An Open Reply to an Open Letter to Taunton's Users

I just typed this and then Drupal lost it. Maybe you can add that to your list of things worth fixing...

Anyway...

Thank you Jason for finally taking the time to reply to the users of your forums. It takes a lot for a guy to step out into the line of fire.

Below I have put your comments in bold so you will know just what I am talking about. For some reason, Drupal removed the "reply" button from your thread. I understand you guys are still working out the bugs in the software, so you may want to look into that. I am sure you are sittin gthere wondering why no one has replied to you when right in your post you say how important feedback from us is, so I thought maybe you'd want to know. Anyway, your comments are bolded mine are plain text.

I have been reading, with growing consternation, the posts related to the switch from mZinga to Drupal based forums. They have ranged from grudging acceptance to mild mourning to xenophobic howls of rage. I am used to this. My career started in moderating message boards and chats at AOL’s Digital City more than 13 years ago. I remember the switch from AOL-style message boards to HTML, so I knew there would be pain in any change. Many complaints, however, have been couched in language so hurtful to the people who build Taunton’s popular and award-winning sites that I feel I need to address the issues.

SO AOL, The Tribune, Lifestyle networks, great career, at the tribune you really climbed the ladder. Kudos to you for that! You must be a good leader to move up so far from such humble beginnings.

I think the people who run Taunton's site should be given credit where it is due. They have built a great community, shown us what a great website can be, and have done wonders for keeping things going in what you refer to as a money-losing venture. More on that later. kudos to you to (as said earlier for stepping out from behind the shield of staff to face the fire. Oh yeah, I checked back, that reply button, its still not showing up.

The original forum was better; this new site looks like it was made by one-handed monkeys using COBOL; bring back my frames: We understand that changing a system you are used to using every day for a number of years can and will be upsetting. It’s akin to someone rearranging your furniture and painting your walls at home while you’re out at work. That said, the long-process the small group of talented people at Taunton Interactive (tech and editorial) went through to launch the new forums with as many features as we could preserve and all of the years worth of your posting data intact, without more than a day’s worth of downtime, was monumental. Is the new forum everything you hoped and dreamed for? No, and us neither. Drupal is, however, an easily updated framework that can be changed directly by the online producers (want comments in reverse chronological order? Change length before pagination? We can do that.) on a regular basis to make it a more perfect experience for everyone involved. We will also be making changes so that you can set your own themes and preferences to view the forums. It is, in my opinion, much better than what we had, and with years of minor and major improvements to come.

That one armed Monkey line is a hoot! Did someone really type it, because it shows great creativity! Anyway, I searched on the site's own searchbar for COBOL, and the only hit that came up was from November of '02. Your own post didn't even get a hit. Oh well, another bug to look into. Luckily if you type "One handed monkey's using COBOL" in Google, it points straight to your post. (yeah this means it takes me longer to find stuff on your site, using your site's own searchbar, but that's OK, it will reduce bounce rates, and Google will bring hits in from the outside.)

Anyway, back on topic. I actually agree with you that there may be better systems out there than frame-driven web design, and I thank God you guys didn't adopt some flash-screen nightmare. On the other hand, what you have presented us is not better than frames. In fact, its worse. A lot worse. I don't blame your staff for this. I mean, everyone I have dealt with there, mostly Steve and Kate, have been fantastic about answering questions, being direct, and trying to maintain order without tipping your hand. They are holding the party line while standing in the line of fire. They are doing an AMAZING job, and have earned every cent you are paying them, and likely a few more. The changeover was a monumental undertaking, and from a tech perspective as well as a human interaction perspective I don't think we can knock either Kate or Steve, although some of our suggestions have been slow to be adopted, but I no longer blame them for that either.

If Drupal is such an easily adapted framework, then something other than the software has to be holding up the changes we have pointed out are needed. I mean when reply buttons go missing in a VP's own post, it points to things. It points to things like people trying to weigh benefits against an audiences's desires. From here right now it feels like Kate has to run the changes through a VP to be sure that things won't mess with the greater plan. Does lime green matter to your approval ratings? What is the ROI of the development time to insert an edit key in every post? How about the UI? Was development time on it cut short when it was realized that there would be no increased ad dollars for an easily navigated site? I mean the whole goal here was to drive down bounce rates after all...

As for the forums being everything we dreamed of... We never dreamed of ANYTHING! We didn't ask for anything, we didn't want anything, we didn't need anything, and we didn't care. It was you who wanted this. Remember, this format is here to increase your hit rate, to increase your profits and to increase your status. Really, we just wanted our community, and we had it and were happy. There was no negotiation here. I mean, if we were part of a negotiation and this is here because we were dreaming of it, can you take me back to where that happened?

You are greedy, it’s all about the money OR you’re killing a goldmine: Yes, it is (in part) about money. It was costing us tens of thousands of dollars to host the free mZinga forums. They were run at an almost complete loss. They were invisible to Google and the rest of our sites and had few ads. So, in a time of drastic financial upset in the publishing world we had three choices: make a cut (person or project), remove the forums, or find a way to keep the forums while drastically lowering costs. We think the forums represent a vibrant community feature and went with #3.

Hasn't management found a better way to sell things than this? That same line is used to justify wage reductions: "Either we cut your salary by n%, or we will have to layoff 20 people," Tax hikes, "Either we raise taxes or we will have to reduce services.", Price increases: "If we don't increase prices by n% we will have to close up shop." and Wars "Either we send in another 30,000 troops or we will have to lose the war"

I think of it as managements way of saying, "take it or leave it, I'm taking my ball and going home. If you don't like what I'm doing then up yer Hoo Ha." How about creativity? How about finding new efficiencies? How about working with your audience to develop new or better ways to do business that encourage them to be loyal to your products. I mean every store around here has Taunton on their Magazine racks, yet I can't remember a single Canadian reference in them. I pick up the mag out of loyalty to the forums, but the information in them is usually for products that aren't available here and plants I can't grow. Of course your web-ographics show that Canadians are only a small percentage of your audience, so I'm likely not worth worrying about.

You didn’t listen enough/much/at all to our suggestions or complaints: We went through a very deliberate process with a Forums Task Force made up of web producers (Matt, Gina, Robyn, Kate & Vicky) who solicited feedback before we launched into the process. Some things could be done at launch, some afterward, and some could not/would not be done at all. We did read all of the feedback, assigned priorities to changes and will be listening for constructive criticism to improve the forums on a regular basis.

The key in this gem is the "Would not". I mean, its nice words, and well said. You almost have me believing you. But I think you probably sat around the table with your staff, listened to the ideas, ran them through a web-based marketing analysis, decided that none of them suited your vision, and then kept one singe idea. Here is the idea you kept... "They like the forums." In my head I see Kate smiling, since she keeps her job, the smile hides fears that she isn't representing the needs of the users. Then I see your smile grow. "We keep the Forums. The forums increase searchable content leading to an increased hitcount. We choke the forums so they are hard to navigate and that increases dwell times and reduces bouncerates. We'll link to ads, and then as the bouncerates drop, introduce more ads as we become a better target for the advertisers." I hear somew yabut's from your staff, see them brushed aside, you steamroll your way to the current format, and your staff fearing repercussions follow along. No, I wouldn't work for you.

Taunton hates us; we hate Taunton; let’s take our ball and go home: What can I say to this? Taunton is a very ethical company with decades of producing the highest-quality content and communities for enthusiasts. We take our role in each community, and the members of those communities, very seriously. No decision is made lightly and never for venial reasons. If any of you feel so strongly that Taunton no longer represents the best way to interact with others about building, gardening, woodworking, sewing and cooking and want to form your own groups or forums on other sites, we wish you well. For those who would like to change what’s here for the better, we are always open to constructive criticism and offers of help. Personal and off-topic attacks, however, will be removed.

Are you Serious! I mean, You have got to be FREAKING KIDDING ME. Is there a special course in pissing me off with the "Not so Young but Angry Conservatives", anyway, here is the deal. You have a handful of people holding taunton's supporters together FOR you until you get things sorted out here. We are providing the support to keep your audience in their seats waiting for the show to start. Heck, Sproutoff even has "Taunton Tuesdays" wher ewe ENCOURAGE our members to come to the site, offer support and feedback, and try to work with you to bring it back to what it was. If it weren't for us keeping your community together, over the past two weeks, your entire online audience would have been scattered to sites like Southern Living, JLC, Gardenweb, and so on. You sit there and say I am DESTROYING community? Dude, I am all the glue there is holding things together for you right now. I think you better say sorry. Lets put this in the right context. I'm standing at center court with may ball and my team, and we're waiting for you to show up.

Thank you for your time and patience. Remember, there are real people (with real names) working long hours behind all of our content you see online. The person you talk to from Taunton in a discussion about formatting your post may have just finished a video shoot from a job site or may be working on a how-to article on planting shrubs. We are a small, but dedicated crew who will strive to give you our best and use the latest in technology to do so. We look forward to growing with you as Taunton Interactive continues to expand online and beyond.

And I am proud of the things those people have done to make Taunton the site it is. I am happy to be associated with them. I am disgusted by the way management is so out of touch with its audience that makes the advertising revenue that it covets work. If you feel the need to reply I can be reached here: http://forums.delphiforums.com/Sproutoff/start. I would look for a reply here, but apparently the button goes missing from time to time.

Jason Revzon

C. Potvin

VP, Taunton Interactive

Moderator, Sproutoff
Cross-posted to http://forums.delphiforums.com/n/mb/message.asp?webtag=Sproutoff&msg=31.1